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Drama or not to drama - that is the question?

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Drama or not to drama - that is the question?
swim2sea

swim2sea

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I can say one thing with absolute certainty, the drama over Lansam has been very beneficial for the other forum. Several members that are very important to me personally have left here and moved because of the drama on this board. I have to agree that lately it has been difficult to find post that doesn't have some kind of drama in it. But that said, it will be very sad if people abandon a forum with openess and transparency to go to one with dictitoral policies that control every piece of information going in and coming out. I agree that lately here the drama has been too much for even me to handle, but I like the idea that we have the right to state our opinions and air our grievances in a public forum without fear of being censored.

Isn't it sad that the other forum doesn't think we have enough sense to know BS from information? That we are so stupid that we cannot sort out the facts from the fiction. Isn't it sad that we are so blind that we let them think this about us and blame it all on the "drama"? I for one am a bid disappointed that they believe we are that dumb. I'm college educated, Master's degree, worked 22 years running a company with millions of dollars of profit and yet I'm not smart enough to read a chat and separate the wheat from the chaff? I have owned numerous businesses in my life with hundreds of employees yet I'm so blind that I let other people tell me what is right and wrong? No, not me, surely they can't mean me????? Yes folks, they do mean us.

To those who left this board to go somewhere there is less drama, let me say this. Remember when we thought Communism was bad, and why we thought it was bad? Because the government controlled information. They decided what could be printed and what could not. They controlled what was done about people who didn't follow the party line. Any of this sound familar? Think about it.
 
Who is saying that over there? Are there threads with people saying that "we" are dumb? If so, are you sure they are speaking of the furum as a whole and not just a few people?

I don't see this as a question of intelligence. Pin trading is a hobby and is supposed to be fun. Some people want to escape the real world and pretend that this one part of their life is magical and drama free. So if they choose to leave and go to a place were that is possible, I don't think you can blame them for that.

We are talking pins, not government. Nobody is forcing anyone to be a member or participate in either forum. It is up to each individual to decide for themself which forum suits them best. I myself have been going over to PinTalk more lately because of what has been going on. And the main reason....because there are certain people here that are banned over there. If it wasn't for the fact that this forum gets more traffic, I'd probably be spending more time over there.
 
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I like it here and I'll be staying here. I really hope we don't start a war between the forums. People have a right to choose which forum to be a part of. And I also don't think this is a matter of intelligence. It doesn't matter what school you went to, if you didn't go to school or anything like that. As pin traders, we should see each other at the same level. I've traded with people from both forums. Let's just all agree to get along.
 
erudolf said:
Who is saying that over there? Are there threads with people saying that "we" are dumb? If so, are you sure they are speaking of the furum as a whole and not just a few people? I think that Lansam is "saying" that by removing threads from their forum and they are getting ready to censor everything that is posted. That concerns me.

I don't see this as a question of intelligence. Pin trading is a hobby and is supposed to be fun. Some people want to escape the real world and pretend that this one part of their life is magical and drama free. So if they choose to leave and go to a place were that is possible, I don't think you can blame them for that. I agree that there is sometimes too much drama on this website even for me, but still I have the right to state my opinions. Drama free is one thing, living in fantasy with no information is another.

We are talking pins, not government. Nobody is forcing anyone to be a member or participate in either forum. It is up to each individual to decide for themself which forum suits them best. I myself have been going over to PinTalk more lately because of what has been going on. And the main reason....because there are certain people here that are banned over there. If it wasn't for the fact that this forum gets more traffic, I'd probably be spending more time over there. Think about why this site gets more traffic, could it be that it is less censored? Maybe that we can say our opinions without fear of being deleted? As for banned people, one of their biggest post contributors was banned from several sites for selling/trading scrapper pins. So there is wrong and right on both sides. But to have them believe we aren't smart enough to sort through a thread for ourselves offends me. I post of both boards, but if I have something to say, I want to say it.
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YoSoyAhPuch said:
I like it here and I'll be staying here. I really hope we don't start a war between the forums. People have a right to choose which forum to be a part of. And I also don't think this is a matter of intelligence. It doesn't matter what school you went to, if you didn't go to school or anything like that. As pin traders, we should see each other at the same level. I've traded with people from both forums. Let's just all agree to get along.
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I agree with you 110% that we should all get along. World peace would also be nice:) But as long as there are different people, there will be different opnions and we should all honor them the same. No one person's opinion is better, more important, or more intelligent than anothers. But we all have the right to express our opinions, the good, the bad and the ugly. I just don't want a company, a person, or a forum telling me what I can and cannot say. That's all.
 
What are pins without drama?

If you think about it, this drama is just another form of it. There's drama about scrappers, who to trade with (or not), etc. Life is, unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on what you think about it) full of drama.
 
I generally choose to read about the drama, but rarely participate. Drama is everywhere and it is generally the result of an unpopular opinion or inflammatory wording and can be very detrimental to any community in which it occurs. I view it as an inescapable reality of the convergence of many different people and personality types. How one deals with the drama is ones personal choice and if we consider ourselves to be intelligent and considerate human beings, then we should respect the resultant decisions of those who wish to avoid drama. I do feel that drama is inevitable and I wonder where the people who choose to move will move to avoid drama next.

I have been and am still a member of at least one forum that is so fraught with drama that several friends have either quit, gone elsewhere, or managed to get themselves banned by crossing the lines drawn by the mods. I know the feeling and understand how terribly destructive drama can be. I also know the value of freedom of speech and can appreciate that I may excersise those rights at any time. I also know that freedom of speech has certain societal boundaries and that crossing those boundaries will render any valid points I may make into something considered just a bunch of spiteful conjecture.

I do find it ironic that some who have chosen to move as a result of drama would inadvertently begin new drama by conjuring up an us versus them mentality. The one enduring quality of the written word is that it can be completely ignored and I may choose to completely bypass inserting my opinion into any drama filled threads.
 
If they don't like the drama or discussions or whatever, they always have the option to...*GASP*...not open the thread!

There's an interesting shift right now, and it's going to be an issue for a while...whether it's a general, mild discussion, or heated debate. But that doesn't mean you (the royal 'you") have to read it personally...there are other things going on in the forum.

That said, I agree about the "it's a hobby" statement, and that people should go where they feel comfortable. I just think they can achieve that by staying and ignoring certain areas just as easily as moving. Personally, I don't feel comfortable in a censored area, so I'll be staying...even if it does get hairy from time to time.
 
wait what drama? I've been here for a few months nd have not see any can someone please tell me what is going on? also yes keep open discusion This forum is a place for making friends trading/buying pins and haveing a grat time.
 
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I completely agree with Swim2Sea. I'm very new to the hobby and granted do not have as much financially or emotionally invested into pin trading as many of you here. However, I choose to stay in this forum because they do allow everyone to speak their mind. Frankly some of the allegations are off the wall, but it;s nice to hear all sides. I can choose to click on the thread and I choose to read it, no one is forcing me to. I joined the other forum out of curiosity, and the removal of information is suspect in my opinion. You put it out there for two days, taking it away doesn't mean that information is erased from our memories. I have a strong distaste for censorship and would rather sift through the drama. So, yes leave the drama. Leave the open discussion. And just a little bit of advise to everyone: don't take yourselves so seriously. We are talking about pieces of metal with pictures of mickey mouse on them. I have met some great people in this forum, I like it here and I'm not going anywhere. Now, I'll get off my :soapbox:
 
How'd you get to post this:

:soapbox:

I just copied & pasted it but I don't see it as an icon...

Oops, found it, now we just need to share the:love:
 
I also just want to jump in and make one thing quite clear: I have been in pins for quite a long time. I have seen pin traders come and pin traders go, but one thing remained constant: as long as there have been pins and pin trading, there has been (and probably will be) drama of some sort. This drama is nothing new - just as the Hunger Games is Running Man for the Twilight generation, this merely is the same drama, just a different cast of players broadcast over a different series of drama networks. End of line.

I really don't like it when people portray the situation as one site vs another. We aren't in the Pin Hunger Games ... and this isn't District PT vs District DPF, where only one can survive and the winner gets showered with gifts. When Dizpins closed, a several sites emerged and people should be free to gravitate towards whichever they feel more comfortable - and should be able to post on more than one if they choose. After all, don't all of these sites exist to connect the pin trading community and create a better trading environment for all?

As far as the 'drama' here goes ... well, I've said it before and I'll say it again because apparently it bears repeating. The internet is a place where people come to exchange ideas. Open discussion is essential. The alternative is that, even with closing threads, you can't make people forget what they've read, and all that will happen is that the conversation will move to chat rooms, text messages, and pin trading nights, where people will have to go off of what they remember reading (if they didn't copy the posts). As a result, the 'truth' will turn into a game of telephone and the 'facts' will become even more distorted. However, with the exchange of ideas will come disagreement, which is fine (when two or more people agree all the time, at least one of them has stopped thinking). The key is to respectfully and maturely disagree with each other, keeping the discussion to the topic and refraining from personal attacks and within TOU, and it should be fine.

If you don't want to read what a potentially drama-laden thread, just don't open it. If you know that a person tends to write posts that are full of drama, you can ignore that individual (if you don't know how, see Grim's tutorial or ask).
 
I sincerely hope it doesn't come down to one site vs the other. I like both places for different reasons. I tried to post a similar thread on PT and it was rejected I guess since it never showed up. Apparently the crackdown on what information gets in a thread is already started. I was pushing the limit I guess when I assumed that it would be OK to express and opinion on PT. Apparently not.

I agree, if you don't like drama, don't read the thread. It's like TV, if you don't like a show, don't watch it. No one forces you to watch a specific show or channel. But at least we have a choice. That's how it is here. We have a choice.
 
Things are tense at the moment, but it will blow over. I am hoping that after a few months or so, we will all be laughing at this and enjoying the hobby again
 
I'm sad to hear that some members have chosen to leave the forum over this. But I for one think that it is important for all of us to be able to discuss this and other things like it. I would much rather hear people's concerns and be better educated about the situation, than to wake up one day and have everything fall apart all the while trying to figure out what just happened. I do agree that I all of the drama is a bit overwelming. But i do hope that once pinpics does reveal the new site everything will settle down and in turn calm down on the forums.

But until then - Everyone try to rmemeber that there are a lot of people who pins are not JUST their hobby. Some people have invested a lot into this - some peoples lively hoods depend on it, so the idea of it declining or possibly collapsing is a very real threat. Others have been pin trading for so long that this is a big part of their lives and so again they feel very passionate and take all changes big and small very seriously. And sometimes when you are passionate about something (especially in text) words do not read the way the author intends.
 
caligirlUCR said:
But until then - Everyone try to rmemeber that there are a lot of people who pins are not JUST their hobby. Some people have invested a lot into this - some peoples lively hoods depend on it, so the idea of it declining or possibly collapsing is a very real threat.
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This may be a controversial statement but I don't really care if someone's lively hood is wrapped up in pins. It's supposed to be a hobby, not a business for anyone but Disney (because they are Disney pins). And if it collapses. Those employees will move on to the next merchandising item Disney is selling. It's not anyone's responsibility to keep Disney pin resellers in business.
 
nWoJeffDW said:
It's supposed to be a hobby, not a business for anyone but Disney (because they are Disney pins). And if it collapses. Those employees will move on to the next merchandising item Disney is selling. It's not anyone's responsibility to keep Disney pin resellers in business.
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+1

As far as free speech goes ... I am all for that too, but people dragging other's name through mud in the name of free speech still does not agree with me.
 
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Id have stopped posting for a while on here until it all settled down as it gets a bit depressing when you click on DISNY PIN DISCUSSION and see hardly any of the recent posts discussing pins just all the drama.

Id have stopped posting but I didnt want to die in the murder mystery xD
 
Merryweather said:
+1

As far as free speech goes ... I am all for that too, but people dragging other's name through mud in the name of free speech still does not agree with me.
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Whoa, you (Jeff & Merryweather) two moved to the other board and now you come back here and say this? I'm expressing an opinion not dragging anyone's name through the mud. You are off topic please refrain from hijacking my post.
 
swim2sea said:
Whoa, you (Jeff & Merryweather) two moved to the other board and now you come back here and say this? I'm expressing an opinion not dragging anyone's name through the mud. You are off topic please refrain from hijacking my post.
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Dear Margaret, I am on both boards. For me, it is not the owners. It is the people in them. I have friends on both boards. I am not choosing a side now, and I won't do that in the future.

I am also sorry that if you took the "dragging through mud" expression as an offense to you. It was NEVER intended for you, but rather as a description of some threads being posted here lately in the name of free speech and expressing opinions.
 
I know in the past , I have been too open mouthed, but I have learned from my bad experiences and have kept my mouth shut . As far as the drama with TN & Lansam , it really is between them . I've been really staying out of those threads . I just want to have fun pin trading, whether it be buying or collecting or trading . I belong to the other forum , but I mainly stay over on this end . Vala and I have even gotten past our past differences . Recently, I have just been keeping to myself rather than listening to he said, she said, nonsense .
 
Tinker, I'm trying to stay out the TN & Lansam mess myself. I just don't approve of their censorship of the board. Several posts that I wrote were "rejected" and did not appear in the threads. So I tried just listing some famous quotes to get my message across.
 
I'm also posting on both boards and was just replying to a statement made by the poster I quoted. I'm not trying to hijack a thread.
 
swim2sea said:
I sincerely hope it doesn't come down to one site vs the other. I like both places for different reasons. I tried to post a similar thread on PT and it was rejected I guess since it never showed up. Apparently the crackdown on what information gets in a thread is already started. I was pushing the limit I guess when I assumed that it would be OK to express and opinion on PT. Apparently not.
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I have checked in PT several times in the last few days and did not see any posts to warrent concern about a "site war."

They have, however gotten sick and tired of all the BS Tiggernut stirred up, so any post that could be construed as part of that mess appears to be rejected. Go figure, they are trying to prevent drama leakage. IDK, everything seems fine to me, I use both forums... In fact I also have a micechat account. :hug:
 
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