Pin Trading Families

I find it a little frustrating when parents dictate and control their kid's pin trading. I'm not talking about the 4 or 5 year olds that don't understand trading and values behind pins (all they know is it's pretty and they want it), I'm talking about older kids/teens that DO understand values and know how to trade, but they're not allowed to because mommy said no.

Now it's obvious if a kid walks up and they see a rack pin or a hidden mickey or a fake vinylmation and they want it and they are offering a rare or expensive pin for it because they don't know any better, then yes a parent should step in and explain nicely that they shouldn't make that trade and should suggest something else. The trader should also take responsibility in not accepting the unfair trade and taking advantage of a unexperienced kid. We all started out that way, and we wouldn't have liked being taken advantage of either, so it's only appropriate to give the same respect to others.

But when the kid is older, they have GOOD pins (and they know it and know values), and they find something that THEY want and are HAPPY with a trade and suddenly a parent goes "Oh no, that trade is NOT happening. I won't allow it." I find that annoying and frustrating. They don't even say nicely "Try to ask for something else" or to make another trade. It's just straight up "You're not allowed to trade that pin." To me, if a parent is going to control a kid's hobby and force them/make them so scared that they have to ASK PERMISSION to make a trade, they shouldn't be doing the hobby at all. If the kid wants it and is happy with the trade that THEY PICKED, then it should remain that way. or the pin needs to remain at home and NOT in a trader bag.


I really just feel like parents need to take a step back and let their kids run their own hobby the way that they like it (with the exceptions listed above).

Has anyone else ever encountered this situation?

That's why when I hand my 9-year old her trading lanyard, its loaded with pins that I could care less about. However, my agenda is for my child to enjoy the hobby, learn to confidently approach people and negotiate her own trades. People often come up to me later and tell me how polite she was and what a pleasure it was to trade with her - Now, if that doesn't make a parent feel proud!

Thing I don't like even more: Parents who control their kids in the hobby be teaching them how to shark other people, and abuse the extra "bodies" to get more pins.

OH yeah my son got takin one year..I could still hit the woman that did it too
Judy

I've seen both good and bad happen. I have friends who let their kids trade whatever they want on their lanyards because those are "their" pins. Even the CM's are like 'Are you sure you want them trading for that pin?' and we're like 'Yup those are their pins to do what they want with'. Some CM's will tell you this is refreshing to hear because they are sick of hearing "Honey don't you want THAT pin?" While pointing to a pin... lol.

I've also had heard from friends who are CM's that their kids are a little older and they thought they could give their kids some pins and that the pin community would not take advantage of a kid at a PTN. Well, of course that didn't happen and the nice pins got taken away until they were a little older and the kids learned not everyone was a nice pin trader and the pins they were giving you were as valuable as you were giving them.

Don't get me wrong. It only took the first time for my daughter to get taken advantage of to teach me that lesson. Hence, the lanyard being loaded with pins I don't care about. There have been times that I have caught myself doing the ole' "Honey, are you sure.....", but, I usually muzzle myself pretty quickly. :rofl: She actually does pretty good for herself. Left me gaping at her a couple of times - "Are you sure you're only nine??"

I will give you an example.
Max likes to collect and build Legos. When he would complete one it would go on the shelf and I did not originally want him to play with it so it wont get broke. Then I thought, they are his, he wants to play with them, and if it breaks he can rebuild them.

Now to pins, Both Max & Lizzie are very saavy and know values and pretty much what we all know about pins including how pinpics works and ebay.
There have been times I personally worked really hard to get a pin that later on one of them decided to trade for another pin. They know what they are doing and I used to always ask, do you really want this pin more than the other. I used to dictate what they can and cant trade but that makes it like my collection so I allow them to do whatever they want. They are educated though. They may see a pin they really want but they will not trade an LE100 for a rack pin, they know to try to trade an equal value pin for it and if they cant work it out, they dont trade.

Kids need to be educated too and its what they want and like, not you. I had a kid that I was trading with at the park and we were doing a 4 pin trade. Each pin was an LE1000 and of equal value. The kids was looking for 2 of the pins I had for a year he said but when his mom looked she did not like his choices and said no to the deal. The characters were not bad, 2 were star Wars and 2 were C&D but the mom did not like the pins and said she would rather have the pins he already has. The kid begged his mom and that he has wanted 2 of them for a year but SHE did not like them.

I think that is wrong. My kids have their books (keepers & traders) and are allowed to enjoy the hobby as I do and they have the freedom and knowledge to trade on their own. The cool thing about Lizie is when a SHARK tries to take advantage of her, she will verbally put them in their place. Teach your kids, let them trade, dont micro-manage and let them have fun.

The majority of people my kids have traded with are very nice and usually will trade easier with them than with an adult because they are usually very nice people. Yes there are sharks but there are way more nice people than sharks and as long as your kids understand the pins, they wont get eaten.

LET KIDS TRADE!

I enjoy taking my baby sis (who is 10 now) and sometimes she just want the most simplest pins out there and i will NEVER DARE tell her not to trade a certain pin for another pin. I believe its up to her and want her to enjoy trading.
~Jessi

iamdisneydan said:

Kids need to be educated too and its what they want and like, not you. I had a kid that I was trading with at the park and we were doing a 4 pin trade. Each pin was an LE1000 and of equal value. The kids was looking for 2 of the pins I had for a year he said but when his mom looked she did not like his choices and said no to the deal. The characters were not bad, 2 were star Wars and 2 were C&D but the mom did not like the pins and said she would rather have the pins he already has. The kid begged his mom and that he has wanted 2 of them for a year but SHE did not like them.

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THIS is the exact situation that I am talking about. The same thing happened to me in a park. We were making a multi-trade, one of which was completed (as the kid picked out THEMSELVES without us making an offer. It was the "we like this pin, what do we have to trade for it?" and THEY picked the pin out). As we were working on the 2nd trade, the parent overlooked and asked what trade was being worked on. When the kid said "We made this trade and we are now working on this one" The parent freaked out and said that they were NOT allowed to make that trade and that the parent refuses to let it happen. That we didn't have anything worthy of the pin being traded away. The kid then said he couldn't trade any of his pins to us thanks to the parent's reaction. We were going to try to trade with the parent after the kid for some of their pins, and we decided to not even bother after what had happened. We even noticed that the kid was upset that they were not allowed to get a pin THEY wanted because the parent said they weren't allowed to trade their own pin.

It's as you said, it makes the pins the parent's collection and not the child's. It's very frustrating. Not only was I annoyed with the parent (plus not being able to make a trade for the pin we wanted as well) but I felt TERRIBLY bad for the kid because I could only imagine how many times something like this has happened and they have not been able to get pins THEY want.

Oh yes Andy(20 year old)knows pins now..but when he was younger he did not know

Judy

Im a parent of 3 my 4 year old is so attached to his pins that he'll make me trade him 2 for 1,but thats within our house i dont allow him to trade w/traders because vhe gets upset when they say no.Now my 8 year old is being educated in value and things like that,he only wants stitch pins but i have to constantly remind him to trade for other things so he can get more variety of traders to get the better stitch pins,i overlook his trades but usually i allow him to do whatever he wants as long as its fair,and some traders are so sweet and will trade something way more valuable for waht hes given them,and some are just rude and mean.it really depends on the person their trading with,but i agree w/ halloweenfiend if the pins are on their lanyard those are theirs to do whatever with.

Here is a fun one.

My husband and I have only been trading for a year and a half. We have been BUYING pins for more than 20 years.

Anyway, one experience was my husband and I were trading at DLR and a little boy came up and needed one of the 2010 Hidden Mickey's to complete his set. This was at the beginning of 2010 when all the HM's were really hard to get. My husband and I had traded really hard to get them, so to us they were worth more to us.

Anyway, The little boy was really adament about wanting a certain pin. His grandmother walked up and said Öh these are traders and they don't trade, just to trade".

Obviously this upset me.

I told her I happily trade with most people and that I BUY my pins unlock the cast members they trade with. I also let her know that the cast members would be coming out with their books, and explained the whole concept to her, nicely!

She then asked if her grandson or her other grandson had anything that they could trade for the 2010 HM.

Now if this woman had been nice and not rude and obnoxious, I would have helped her out. I really would. I cannot even begin to tell you how much money I have "GIVEN" away by helping people out. I have no problem with it and I don't need to be applauded for it.

I refuse to be treated rudely though.

I apologized and said that the pins they are trading were from starter sets that I basically had and that the pin her grandson was wanting was something I had worked hard to find, so I could complete the set with the ones I still needed.

She just grabbed her grandson and walked off.

A couple of minutes later, they come back. Still offering the same thing. My husband nicely steped in and said it would be best if he tried someone else. (M y husband NEVER gets involved) He could tell how much this was bothering me.

Anyway, about 10 minutes later the little boy came up to me and said what if I were to buy you a pin like this. (He held up some rack pin, that I assumed he would probably give me, rather than go buy it.) At this time my husband had walked to where the cast members had just come out and was standing talking to one.

I turned to the boy and said fine, whatever. I had, had it and I did not care anymore. The little boy walked away, I assumed he was telling his grandmother that he wanted to trade the pn on the card.

My husband came back from speaking with the cast member and his head was smoking! What I mean is that the little boy's grandmother had gone up to the cast member and told them that "That lady (me)" had told her grandson to go in and buy her a pin for the one he wanted. My husband stood right there and said her grandson was lying. (She did not know he was my husband as he was not with me when she came up the first time with her grandson) She said her grandson did not lie and that the lady told him that. My husband said that the lady was his wife and that I never asked him to buy a pin, that her grandson showed me a pin that he offered.

The cast member told the woman there was nothing that could be done as it was not wrong to ask for someone to buy a pin to trade. (That was the first time I had heard that)

That was not the end. The boy came up again, offering another lackluster pin. Yes, again. I told him I would not trade with him until he told his grandmother the truth. He looked back and she rudely said "I already know"".

I was flabbergasted, to say the least. I told the boy to take the pin and give me anything he wanted. He asked which one and I said I did not care. I was sooooooo upset. I have never been treated so badly before and this was when we were still new to trading.

The boy was about 12 and his grandmother was about 50. I am not talking about an old lady. I am talking about a mature woman who should know better than to treat people with rudeness.

Parents aren't the only ones, but yes, I run into them too.

Oiy vey!!!

I have a 9 year old and a nearly 12 year old, and we've been collecting and trading for nearly 3 years. When we first starting trading, the Pin Trading Store at Downtown Disney used to have the tables set up and many of the traders were sharks who wanted us to buy them an LE pin from the store for the "got to have that pin it's so rare HM." Being newbies, we had no idea that they were taking advantage of us. Somehow, my then 6 year-old named those people, "Doo-puters." Now, whenever we see adults trading and trying to be unfair, we have our code word for them and walk away.

In reality, my kids have their own lanyards with the stuff they want to trade. Whatever they want to trade and whatever they want to trade for is fine with me. They are smart enough to hand me any LEs or non-traders to put away, not because they might trade the pin, but more likely that they'll lose it as we run to Soarin' or Toy Story Midway Mania.

When we do trade with non cast-member adults at Epcot, they go through the books and see what they like, and I usually do the negotiating with questions to my kids (in front of the traders) revolving around "do you think this is a fair deal?" This makes it a teaching and business-like experience for them. Regardless, this is a GREAT family experience for all of us.

Vicki, you're learning some Yiddish!

jjgasman said:

Vicki, you're learning some Yiddish!

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You mean Oiy Vey? lolol have been saying it for years. I figure if I look back far enough, there is a little bit of everything in me. lolol I gladly accept everything

my 14 year old son knows more than I do. lol

rohad said:

my 14 year old son knows more than I do. lol

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My nephew will be 14 in February and he knows a lot more than me. Actually he is the little booger that got us into this mess, we all call Pin Trading. lololol

My sons 12 and 14 are the master traders here lol. Actually, most of the wants on our list are combined between all of us, as we all like the same stuff. The HG list is all of ours, as we decided to collect the same kind of pins. But if they ever wanted to trade with someone in WDW or anywhere else, I would definitely not turn them down. They are old enough and know enough about pins.

My 11 yr old is coming with me to the Love Event. He has loaded his bag and he gets to do with them what he wishes. I probably won't see him all day untill the Chocolate comes out. He will be easy to spot, looks like me and says Yawl, WhatChaNeedForThatPin, YaWannaTrade and Thanxs. Remember, Arkansans are the Kings of One Word Sentences.

My daughter (8 years old) and I are a pin trading team! I'm not sure she fully understands the difference between trading with a castmember and a regular person, but I think she's slowly getting it. We both enjoy the hobby and are excited to be attending the upcoming "Florida Project" event in WDW this September.

My boys 12 and almost 10 and I started collecting in Feb. 08 when we went to WDW. We didn't trade for a lot of pins then as it got pretty expensive buying those booster packs at the park. The boys wanted to trade those "junk pins," as they called them, for nicer ones. We've now got a whole bunch of "junk pins" just waiting for our next trip. We'll load up the lanyards and they can trade to their hearts content.

All of our trading now is through PinPics and the forums. I try to do multi trades whenever possible. I try to get something for all of us. I call them into the office and let them look through the other persons trades to see what they like and try to match up LE/trade ratio/etc. with the other person's wants. That way they learn to try and make even trades.

I'll go along the lines of what Dyma said. When my daughter goes to WDW, she will have her traders lanyard, with pins selected especially for her to trade for whatever she wants. As she gets older, and learns about trading (and human nature) she can make the decisions on her own.

At pin trading meets, until she is older, mommy and daddy will assist her in the trading. Just be there to make sure the trade she makes is a fair one for both parties. It will also provide a good opportunity to teach her that sometimes it's better to wait, and eventually if you are patient, you will get what you want.

She is still just an infant, so I have a little time, and I'm quite sure by age 7 or 8 she'll be a way better trader than I am.

Ok, I used to trade outside DTD when they had the tables there and I am not a shark! At least I try not to be. I trade fairly, one for one and at DTD a lot of people used to show up there that didn't have AP's to trade.

Anyway, back to the trading with kids subject, one thing that really is annoying to me that I didn't mention before is when a kid comes up to me with a lanyard all ready to trade and then the parent grabs him/her and says, "You don't want to trade with then, they're professionals!"

Professional what?! I've said something a couple of times to the parents and asked the kid what pins they were interested in? I try to teach them that a rack pin is not equal to an LE 100 and they get it. Most of the time they just want a cool looking pin and I tell them they can have any pin on a page and they're cool with that. I also will tell the parent that not all people trade like I do but some people do and not to judge a pin trader by their lanyard.

Something to think about

As for pin trading families, there's plenty to be said about this.

Yes, there are those who warn their children about 'those traders' with all the disdain that can be doled out. It goes both ways; someone had to take advantage of them in order for them to feel that way. Sometimes, it is the very situation where the child picks out (more often than not) the most valuable pin in the book. Yes, we feel some remorse when having to say 'no', but then kindly offer a rationale behind trading. Doing this lets the uninformed better understand the process and helps them with future trades. For those who purposely send their kids 'fishing', it lets mommy or daddy know that we're not fools.

What truly is at stake is the loss of fun for the kids when they get involved at an early age. All the kids know is that getting certain pins makes the parent(s) happy, so they imitate what they see. In many cases, this is a form of reinforcement (B.F. Skinner). The kids go to the lanyards and run back to mom/dad. Mom/dad either praise or admonish the kids for the trade. Kids walk away knowing what kind of trades elicit certain responses. The kids will always look for the positive responses.

Now take the parents who've coached the kids and look at the previous model of reinforcement. Gets a little sad when you think about it, because we've all seen this happen at one point or another. Worse yet, some kids pick up potentially illegal habits (five-finger discounts) when at pin trading. Yes, we managed to prevent one from happening, but whenever we see those kids at the park or at PTN, they (and we) do know better. I wonder what their reinforcement model was?

Let's take a look at a child who trades on their own. They begin to trade, then realize they need better traders. Through their own experience and social interaction with other pin traders, the child begins to understand the value of pins on what they know (industry vs. inferiority, E.Erikson). The child now knows in order to be successful, they must be able to get the pins that are in demand; personal internal shame comes from the inability to trade for popular pins. The child then roams the parks and looks at lanyards more than enjoys the park. Does this sound familiar?

Yes, getting a child to pick a hobby, a healthy hobby, can help develop character, values, and self-esteem. Pin trading is no different. The only variable in this venue is that the pins may have potential monetary value, and in this economic period and online market-driven system, seems to skew the perspective of collecting for collecting sake. With this in mind, some traders offer pages or boards for the kids to select from, which is helpful. Other times, some traders will let go of something pretty decent to make a kid's day. If anything, what we can take from this, as adults, is to provide a positive, informative experience for young traders and remind both parents and children that this is only a hobby and one part of the park they can enjoy. As pin traders, we are unpaid, de facto representatives of the park; whether we like it or not, we help create future traders. Let's make it a good experience for us all.