PIN & POP A Poll and Discussion: Pin and Pop Inspection Process, What Are Your Thoughts?

[hopemax]

Last TA, I put a link to a post of mine here in the "Problem Pins" thread, in the Condition Notes field. If you notice the post #xx on the upper right of your post, that is a link specifically to that post. You can right click and copy the URL and then paste it in the Condition Notes on P&P.

 

[TheMickeyMouseRules]

Not seeing mentioned:

• The amount of time and resources pinandpop staff use to provide the minor flaw detection. (I think this one is huge for PnP's costs - their current payment for their time doesn't take this amount of inspection into consideration... so we all are having to pay more.)
• Pinandpop points out things that could be called natural variations during the manufacturing process.
• The normalization pinandpop lends to this level of flaw inspection with all pin traders. (This level of inspection is not normal... in my 10+ years of experience in this hobby.)
• Each pin trader has to pay a token for the cancelled trade.
  • (Note: I have no issue with PnP getting paid for their time inspecting pins... whether a trade goes through or not PnP should be paid for their time.)

Sum total in the experience is Negative for Flawed pin owner:

1) the trader's pin is tied up for months waiting for inspection​

2) the trader is charged a token because of their trade partner's decision (could be a perfectionist pin trader, an opportunistic pin trader, or a newby not understanding blemishes, gets scared & cancels.)​

3) the trader receives back a pin of less value (ethics may state disclosure of blemish findings (blemishes the trader didn't notice and perhaps still cannot see with their naked eye upon return of the pin to them.))​

Another idea for fairness/balance: if the level of blemish inspection continues perhaps the trader who uses the blemish to back out of the trade pays PnP for both tokens (this would resolve #2 above).

Just throwing more for a great discussion. I am appreciating everyone's comments. Keep 'em coming.

 

[TheMickeyMouseRules]

To clarify/standardize the poll I added some wording to options 2 and 3 about seeing with naked eye and using minor/major in a way that is more consistent. Votes may be changed if the clarifications change how you want to respond to the poll above.

 

[ViciousLady]

I will say even when I was trading every week in person at the parks 20 years ago - there were people who had little light up magnifying glasses and inspected pins for any blemishes or flaws that most people would not be able to see 'at a glance with the naked eye.' So I DO believe that such perfectionist collectors have existed and continue to exist, and hey more power to them, but I tended to avoid traders that I knew had a reputation for being so critical and picky because they also tended to skew their valuations in a way I disagreed with.
The difference is that it cost me nothing to look at their pins, have them look at mine and trade or not trade, it was a matter of minutes and a shrug. When you have to take your pin out of trade circulation for months and pay for a service that does not even result in a trade - I think this is where the major frustrations are arising.

 

[GeraldineWH]

As frustrating as I sometimes get with the day to day, when I receive my P&P package with the pins that have gone through I'm a happy person and that will keep me trading on P&P. I have also expanded to trading through the Pinpics trade assist. I do also have in person trading available to me locally or local-ish and I also trade that way.

When a pin is denied for a blemish on Pin and Pop I am of course disappointed and a bit frustrated and I put it aside as an in person trader so that the person I am trading with can inspect the pin in person and that has been successful. I have actually had a pin rejected through Pin and Pop due to (magnified) flaws and that same trader who rejected it saw me/the pin at an in person trade event, and traded for the pin at the in person event. So yes, I think the magnification sometimes scares off traders/trades, but I understand Pin and Pop wanting to provide full disclosure.

I don't think I would be frustrated with rejected pins if the turn around time from Pin and Pop wasn't so long. I don't mind the pin being rejected per se, but I do mind being without the pin for so long and having it rejected.

I am a picky trader about flaws. I do accept some pins that Pin and Pop says are uncertain or blemished because I've learned over time how to evaluate the magnified photos for myself, but I also reject many. I take into consideration what/where the blemish is located and the likelihood I'll see it or it will bother me, what pin I'm trading away, what the "trade" value is, the rarity of the pin, whether I think I'll be able to trade it to someone else if I tire of the pin, and then decide whether I'm willing to take a risk. In my beginning days of Pin and Pop I'm sure I declined every uncertain or blemished pins but now that I have more experience and trust myself more, I give my own careful consideration and so far I've been satisfied. Less experienced traders or traders who are risk adverse are going to be more likely to decline.

I think flaws and pin trading values go hand in hand. I know production flaws are out of our control but if I buy a pin at retail I may have the option to return the pin if it is flawed, or I can chose to keep it for retail price. When trading, traders are (usually) not trading at retail price they are trading at market value - which can be a big difference. While I might tolerate a flaw at retail price, I am not going to be inclined to trade for a flawed pin that is trading at 2x, 3x, 4x the retail price. 'll wait for a non-flawed one at that cost. Also, if a pin is a common open edition pin and there are tens of thousands of these pins out there easily accessible why should I accept a flawed pin when I can get a non-flawed one? If you want to trade to me at retail or less than retail with the flaw I'll consider it. But if it is a flawed pin being traded for significantly more than retail price, or it is a super common pin I can easily pick up elsewhere, then I'll decline and wait and get a pin without flaws.

Pin and Pop has to be cautious because as much as some people complain the review is too harsh with magnification, others would complain they got a flawed pin they don't want. I'm one of those that will happily pay 2 tokens for a thorough review and for me that might include asking for a video so I can see flaws from different angles and without the magnification. To me it is worth the tokens because I am paying for a service I'm requesting and because I am saving so much on shipping by batch shipping. I've been paying close to $6.00 to ship one or two pins through PinPic assisted mail trades whereas I ship an entire box to Pin and Pop for no more than double that and maybe less. So I think the savings on shipping needs to be considered when considering the costs of using Pin and Pop. I think it is a nice option for those like me who want to selectively pay for the review to have the option to do so, and those who don't want to pay for it have the option not to do so - and perhaps this will speed up the process for everyone overall.