DSF Brave pins & ebay

while there are still forum members waiting in line and hoping beyond hope that they will get their beloved pins , Brave Marquee and the other three are fetching $84.99 - the 3 bears at $49.99 . I can not believe how people are that they have to take the pins from the collectors that stayed there from yesterday morning till it opened this morning, like everyone else and walked away empty handed . I know of one member that was behind the 150 wrist band and walked along asking are you getting one set or two . And everyone basically said two, you mean to tell me that not one person could help a fellow pin collector/trader , that money is more important than compassion .
I know I will catch slack for this, but I don't care . This makes me so sad ! I'm lucky enough that I got a set at cost because i have a dear sweet friend that does not over charge because as she says. I'm standing there for myself anyway .
If you want to crucify me for this post, feel free , anyone that does is one of these people I mentioned . So hold up your greedy hand .

I really wanted a set of these. It is very frustrating that I could not get them because everyone standing in line for 19 hours! I am just not willing to do that.
I am wondering if a limit of 1 set per person would help to fix these problems. Then 300 could buy them rather than only 150.

I hope they change it to limit one per person, that will get everyone pissed especially the ones who resell them, but then everyone will be happy and it can be fair! to those who didnt get the brave pins, go watch the movie and enjoy it, that's what Im going to do and tinker, You have a great friend, who would say something like that "standing for myself" great friend

As long as there is a demand for it, people will keep doing it. This is what drives the trade. The feeling of getting a pin that is rare and sought after is a great feeling to some, and the high prices reflect the demand for the pin. People MUST be buying these pins for high prices, or else they would not be there!

I sent a nice message to DSF via Facebook asking them to consider changing the limits to 1 per person so more people like me that have no chance of waiting overnight can actually have a shot at the pins. I think if they got a few more nicely worded messages from some other people they may actually consider it.

Those people getting two, they could have been getting some for friends, I know I had some friends pick me up brave pins today.

It is unfortunate that people dont all get them. Keep in mind though, there are 2 types of ebay sellers. The ones your thinking of who bring their entire family to buy 6 sets, and make a huge profit, which I agree, they suck....

and the others, like me.. We sold just enough of our second set to cover our cost of both. We cannot afford pin trading otherwise.

Please also remember, that those pins being bought for an arm and a leg on ebay are being bought by other collectors, who cannot get to the event, or dont live nearby. Some are even being sold to over seas collectors.

Mark up: yeah, its crazy... No i dont defend the prices such as last months Tangled PODMH's. But, double the price or maybe a bit more, lets do the math.

lets use simple math, I only had one cup of coffee.
$16.00 pin. x 4 pins (yeah, the bears are 3 pins at 19, close enough.) = $64.00 a set.
How do you value your time, over night, outside, in a Hollywood alley where bums have been known to sleep and pee (yup, pee)

This release people started at 10am. Lets round up to a more average time, say 2pm? Thats 19hours standing/sitting/waiting for the release the next day. Even at the average times in the past, say 6pm, it is still 15hours. Plus cost of food/drinks while there.

If a seller sells the set at double price, so, 128 total, they are getting paid very very little for their time and effort to get pins out to non-locals. So, if people online are willing to pay 80 for one of the pins, why wouldn't they? It certainly covers their costs, pays them for sitting in the alley, and lets them keep a set for themselves for trade or collecting.

I know, its not what you want to hear, i am sorry. For those DSF releases I cannot attend, I feel crappy about missing them too. I feel horrible about missing WDW or DLRP releases as well. But you notice, those pins when low LE's are marked up significantly as well. It isn't just California people. And many of those high priced Tangled PODMH's are shipping from Florida, not here in california. Please don't be angry at us when it is everyone.

Psycho Pixie said:

It is unfortunate that people dont all get them. Keep in mind though, there are 2 types of ebay sellers. The ones your thinking of who bring their entire family to buy 6 sets, and make a huge profit, which I agree, they suck....

and the others, like me.. We sold just enough of our second set to cover our cost of both. We cannot afford pin trading otherwise.

Please also remember, that those pins being bought for an arm and a leg on ebay are being bought by other collectors, who cannot get to the event, or dont live nearby. Some are even being sold to over seas collectors.

Mark up: yeah, its crazy... No i dont defend the prices such as last months Tangled PODMH's. But, double the price or maybe a bit more, lets do the math.

lets use simple math, I only had one cup of coffee.
$16.00 pin. x 4 pins (yeah, the bears are 3 pins at 19, close enough.) = $64.00 a set.
How do you value your time, over night, outside, in a Hollywood alley where bums have been known to sleep and pee (yup, pee)

This release people started at 10am. Lets round up to a more average time, say 2pm? Thats 19hours standing/sitting/waiting for the release the next day. Even at the average times in the past, say 6pm, it is still 15hours. Plus cost of food/drinks while there.

If a seller sells the set at double price, so, 128 total, they are getting paid very very little for their time and effort to get pins out to non-locals. So, if people online are willing to pay 80 for one of the pins, why wouldn't they? It certainly covers their costs, pays them for sitting in the alley, and lets them keep a set for themselves for trade or collecting.

I know, its not what you want to hear, i am sorry. For those DSF releases I cannot attend, I feel crappy about missing them too. I feel horrible about missing WDW or DLRP releases as well. But you notice, those pins when low LE's are marked up significantly as well. It isn't just California people. And many of those high priced Tangled PODMH's are shipping from Florida, not here in california. Please don't be angry at us when it is everyone.

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I agree 100%

I 100% agree with Psycho Pixie. 19 hours that's not even minimum wage for sellers, plus food, parking and gas. The people that have friends that buy for them all the time you should feel very very lucky even if they have to stand in line for themselves they don't have to buy for you they could use them to trade or sell to cover their own sets. It's their choice but you should feel very lucky.

DSF can't do limit 1, they don't have room for 300 people. Barely enough for 150!? Even at limit
1, still 300 would show up for good pins like these.

bjean said:

What if DSF increased the edition size from 300 to 500?? That would help a little ... seems like DSF pins are selling out faster and faster these days so ah ... hey Disney Soda Fountain, wanna make a few more $?? Increase your LE size from 300 to 500! There are lots of DSF pins I would love to add to my collection but I live in Northern California so making frequent trips to DSF is NOT an option ... have you see the price of gas these days, lol!! But I have learned that if I wait awhile, sometimes one of those highly sought after pins will come my way ... and usually though the magic of pin trading! Take care everyone; hope everyone at least had fun while waiting for the pin release! I'm waaaay too old to camp out like y'all did! My hats off to you!! Sending Pixie Dust your way!! *bjr

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I live in Nor Cal too. The price of gas to drive there and back (around $200) is insane.

I personally don't understand why DSF lets or encourages people to line up in such a manner. Do they like the attention they are getting? I do not think so, probably it makes hem work more if anything. Probably it is part of the culture and you have to live it to understand, but still ....

I remember how most of the malls did not allow lining up at Disney Stores before the designer princess doll release. Maybe DSF should not allow lining up before 6 am of release day or something like that. People who want to keep/trade or re-sell can still get their pins if they get there early enough, but at least the "overnight" craze would be done away with.

This is becoming almost like a statue symbol now, the earlier you get there, the more you deserve the pins and then you have the right to expect higher prices and/or harder trades. I can't help wondering how is this attitude helping with the "pin trading spirit".

On the other hand, I really can't blame anyone who stands there for hours, sometimes with little children in tow and hope that they can make a few $$ out of it. I just wish that there were easier ways to get these wonderful pins

I do not mean disrespect to anyone, just pondering ....

I kinda like the idea of an time limit for early line up. Didnt they do that with one release? Say, midnight? You would still however have people hovering in the nearby areas, parkinhg lots, streets etc until the exact time of line up.

Changing the edition size might or might not help. at 500 edition it would still create the "special" quality, but it wouldnt change the pre-sell craze.
Making it 1 set per customer wont change anything, the big profit sellers will just pay more of their friends to tag along. I saw at least one person yesterday with 5 friends/family along for the ride in line. And i was only there for a couple hours before heading home to let my husband deal with the overnight.

There just isn't a way for DSF to prevent people from lining up. People will anyway. In the alley or otherwise. And then you'll have a repeat of the Up release.

Essentially this is just the way it is now- there isn't much DSF can do aside from online random drawing wristbands. And that won't curtail the market on eBay. Nothing will stop the free market- except people NOT buying at those prices.

The idea to change edition size just doesnt fly with me- If that's the case why have ANY limited editions? The concept of LE is intrinsically part of this hobby.

Yes everyone could get them, but then what? The collectibility would be removed, and I believe that's the draw for a lot of traders. (not me- I still would have bought these Brave pins)

And fairness doesn't come into play at all. This is the real world. You want it bad enough you are gonna have to camp out for 20 hours (which yes is insane) OR spend $200. It's rough but that's the situation.

I'm not trying I sound like a jerk- and if I do it's probably because I just "slept" in an alley for small colorful pieces of metal... So I apologize in advance. Lol

I remember last month I offered a DPF member a set of the books for $90, and this person was appalled that I would ask so much for them. A couple days before the release she wrote me back saying she would accept my offer, but I replied that it was no longer on the table.

To that person I am probably the most horrible trader that ever lived. But hey, I tried to give her a set at a fair price. She gave me grief for asking a ridiculous price of $90 for four hinged books.

I learned a valuable lesson with her.

Psycho Pixie said:

It is unfortunate that people dont all get them. Keep in mind though, there are 2 types of ebay sellers. The ones your thinking of who bring their entire family to buy 6 sets, and make a huge profit, which I agree, they suck....

and the others, like me.. We sold just enough of our second set to cover our cost of both. We cannot afford pin trading otherwise.

Please also remember, that those pins being bought for an arm and a leg on ebay are being bought by other collectors, who cannot get to the event, or dont live nearby. Some are even being sold to over seas collectors.

Mark up: yeah, its crazy... No i dont defend the prices such as last months Tangled PODMH's. But, double the price or maybe a bit more, lets do the math.

lets use simple math, I only had one cup of coffee.
$16.00 pin. x 4 pins (yeah, the bears are 3 pins at 19, close enough.) = $64.00 a set.
How do you value your time, over night, outside, in a Hollywood alley where bums have been known to sleep and pee (yup, pee)

This release people started at 10am. Lets round up to a more average time, say 2pm? Thats 19hours standing/sitting/waiting for the release the next day. Even at the average times in the past, say 6pm, it is still 15hours. Plus cost of food/drinks while there.

If a seller sells the set at double price, so, 128 total, they are getting paid very very little for their time and effort to get pins out to non-locals. So, if people online are willing to pay 80 for one of the pins, why wouldn't they? It certainly covers their costs, pays them for sitting in the alley, and lets them keep a set for themselves for trade or collecting.

I know, its not what you want to hear, i am sorry. For those DSF releases I cannot attend, I feel crappy about missing them too. I feel horrible about missing WDW or DLRP releases as well. But you notice, those pins when low LE's are marked up significantly as well. It isn't just California people. And many of those high priced Tangled PODMH's are shipping from Florida, not here in california. Please don't be angry at us when it is everyone.

Click to expand...

I mostly agree with this except I think there is one key point missing.

Rewind a year or two. DSF weren't that hot (at least I didn't get the impression they were because nobody was talking about this craziness). Sure, once in a blue moon there was a really good release and people would get there really early. People would buy pins and sell them for reasonable amounts because they weren't that hard to get. Then Disney Shopping not making pins anymore and a few previous releases from DSF skyrocketing in price (Up and Tangled), people start looking to DSF more and the more sellers start looking there.

So then the Marvel release comes along and people line up at mid-night and justify the $150 price tag because they had to wait in line 9 hours. And that worked out quite nicely so when the hinged book release came out people brought more people earlier and justify the $175 price tag because they had to wait in line 12 hours. Now more people see how much money other people are making so for this release they decide to come even earlier and justify a $200 price tag because they had to wait in line for 19 hours.....and the vicious cycle continues.

So the struggle I'm having with this is that it isn't necessarily the demand for the pins that is driving these prices....it seems to be more the demand for inventory. Sellers are elbowing each other for the inventory and it is the buyer that ends up getting bruised.

And it isn't necessarily eBay's fault either. I love eBay and would be pretty screwed without it. It is the way these prices are being set that's the problem. I have a love/hate relationship with Buy It Now. I love it because you can get some great deals and you can get instant gratification without days of worrying and watching an auction. On the other hand, like in this case, it can be the enemy. People are listing these at $200 because they can....no necessarily because they are worth it. Right or wrong, it just ends up sucking a lot of fun out of the hobby because it leaves very little room for the pins to grow in value and encourage trading. I think it has the opposite affect because if someone has to shell out and arm and a leg for new pins they are going to be much more picky about what they are willing to trade them for.

Just my random thoughts....

I would agree that the death of Disney shopping pins has increased the desire for DSF- there are simply fewer places for unique pins

But I disagree about your use of "worth". If people pay $200 then it is indeed worth $200. Buyers set the market, not sellers. There's no judgment in that, on any sort of intrinsic value of a pin. Just that what someone will pay for something sets its worth or value at that price.

I think a great solution would be for DSF to have all of their pins be surprise pins They announce them on Facebook, the word spreads out, and people head over there at different times! That's just my opinion, though. OR they could have a 6am line-up time, not too sure how that'd work out though!

Psycho Pixie said:

It is unfortunate that people dont all get them. Keep in mind though, there are 2 types of ebay sellers. The ones your thinking of who bring their entire family to buy 6 sets, and make a huge profit, which I agree, they suck....

and the others, like me.. We sold just enough of our second set to cover our cost of both. We cannot afford pin trading otherwise.

Please also remember, that those pins being bought for an arm and a leg on ebay are being bought by other collectors, who cannot get to the event, or dont live nearby. Some are even being sold to over seas collectors.

Mark up: yeah, its crazy... No i dont defend the prices such as last months Tangled PODMH's. But, double the price or maybe a bit more, lets do the math.

lets use simple math, I only had one cup of coffee.
$16.00 pin. x 4 pins (yeah, the bears are 3 pins at 19, close enough.) = $64.00 a set.
How do you value your time, over night, outside, in a Hollywood alley where bums have been known to sleep and pee (yup, pee)

This release people started at 10am. Lets round up to a more average time, say 2pm? Thats 19hours standing/sitting/waiting for the release the next day. Even at the average times in the past, say 6pm, it is still 15hours. Plus cost of food/drinks while there.

If a seller sells the set at double price, so, 128 total, they are getting paid very very little for their time and effort to get pins out to non-locals. So, if people online are willing to pay 80 for one of the pins, why wouldn't they? It certainly covers their costs, pays them for sitting in the alley, and lets them keep a set for themselves for trade or collecting.

I know, its not what you want to hear, i am sorry. For those DSF releases I cannot attend, I feel crappy about missing them too. I feel horrible about missing WDW or DLRP releases as well. But you notice, those pins when low LE's are marked up significantly as well. It isn't just California people. And many of those high priced Tangled PODMH's are shipping from Florida, not here in california. Please don't be angry at us when it is everyone.

Click to expand...

Excellent laying out of the math.

I would not stand outside for the Designer dolls. By the time you did the math on an overnight wait, it wasn't worth it to me. Fortunately, I have great friends in the UK who were able to use the web site to get mine.

erudolf said:

So the struggle I'm having with this is that it isn't necessarily the demand for the pins that is driving these prices....it seems to be more the demand for inventory. Sellers are elbowing each other for the inventory and it is the buyer that ends up getting bruised.

Click to expand...

Like most trends, it's panic that's causing the high prices. If everyone would just calm down and refuse to pay those insane prices, then we wouldn't have these situations.

I think a handful of surprises have caused these "snatch it now" reactions (Grape Soda, Designer princess, Reveal/Conceal Girls), and now everyone freaks out that if they don't get them STAT, then they'll never see them. In some cases, it's true, but I'd say in 95% of the cases for DSF pins, you WILL see them later at a better price.

In the end, we're screwing ourselves...

I get the feeling that something will change soon. I don't know if that means bigger edition sizes, random online drawings, limit 1 per person, or something else. There were a lot of managers taking notes about the crowd yesterday. I can't imagine they're happy about the extra employees they need to keep an eye on it or the fact that they lose the use of that alley for El Capitan guests to line up in.

liquidhavok said:

There just isn't a way for DSF to prevent people from lining up. People will anyway. In the alley or otherwise. And then you'll have a repeat of the Up release.

Essentially this is just the way it is now- there isn't much DSF can do aside from online random drawing wristbands. And that won't curtail the market on eBay. Nothing will stop the free market- except people NOT buying at those prices.

Click to expand...

I still think the RSP system is the best- everyone gets a shot, and there's no need to waste people's time in overnight lines.

Don't worry Erica, I got your set! You're going to love these pins!