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PinPics - New Format / Big Site Changes!

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PinPics - New Format / Big Site Changes!
I had typed out a long post, and then my internet crapped out and lost it, and I do not have the energy to repeat it.

These weren't questions.

Right now, I'm feeling like the posts I made about my concerns about PinPics when Molly Anne and family bought PinPics which included a suggestion to refer to the older posts here, concerning the period following when LANSAM bought PinPics in 2012 including my own posts, were futile, and I know you were a participant in at least one of the threads where I made them, because I just reread it. I feel talked down to, when I know what I've already posted in regards to the complexity of the challenges any new owners would be facing, and specific ways to improve things. And the crazy thing about it is Chris from Pin & Pop contacted me about the things I said at the time, and we talked a little and I've seen some of those things be included in updates. I've also seen some of the suggestions I've made over the years implemented at My Pin Central too (even though I have no plans to use that site, other than some research, for reasons). Did someone read them, or did someone else independently have the same idea, I don't know. But seeing some sites implement the things people have been asking for, demonstrates we weren't off our rockers for suggesting them.

For example, this is one of the things I said in 2021, "This is one of the reasons I've been a long time advocate of any new database using Keyword Tagging approach, instead of relying on Users for properly spelling something, or including all the characters on a pin, or listing all the movie associations. One of the benefits of a database system is the data integrity that comes from storing information as numbers in fields instead of just "text." It has to be correct once, and then everyone else selects from a dropdown or autofill. Keyword tagging also helps with things like searching for Si or Am or Nana or bringing up on the Chip (chipmunk) pins vs Chip (the teacup) or pulling up all "Walt Disney World" pins that SAY "Walt Disney World" on them instead of every pin that was ever released at Walt Disney World. Similar thing, but a field for Series. People want a quick way to find all the pins in a series, and while trying to normalize the name helps, typos or missing one entry where someone did it wrong leads to duplicate listings." Highlighting the points where I demonstrate knowledge of the problems with the old site, and pointing out that normalization of nomenclature won't be enough, and I'm sure PinPics Mods will learn in time with the volume of times they have to fix stuff. And no, I'm not expecting people to remember everything everyone said. But when you run into people who demonstrate knowledge, responding as if they don't, isn't helpful. Mansplaining exists as a term for a reason.

I feel that your eagerness to defend PinPics and "explain," completely blows right past the more general points I was trying to make, and so as a response, it is unsatisfactory and your answer to 4c completely misinterprets what I mean by set listings vs individuals. It's not pins that were sold together, like the Harvey's set you mentioned. It's pins that were *never* released *together* (only at the same time) combined into a single entry. It would be like if Harvey's released 3 separate pins on the same day, but then on PinPics they were photographed and listed together as one item. That is what has happened with the TDS game pins.

I don't really need explanations about why things aren't right. I have a pretty good idea, that is confirmed with each new data point. But the PinPics owners seem to be confused about why people are so hard on them, why people aren't helping more, and I'd also guess why their work so far hasn't been as well received as they had hoped (ultimately the point in buying PinPics in the first place, right). My attempts to address that, appear to be for naught. And so the message is received loud and clear about the futility. But for one final go... you listed your reasons why Pin & Pop does not work for you... I listed areas in which PinPics does not work for me, and probably others. And the reply feels like a combo of "your expectations are too high," and "it works fine / that's the way it is." If Pin & Pop replied to you that way, I'd guess you would be pretty disappointed in that sort of response too, and make you even less eager to use that site.

And ugh, this is far too long again.
Hopemax - I would love to see your suggestions. When we bought this in 2021, we were pretty overwhelmed and may have overlooked your suggestions. If you are open to sharing them with me please do at molly@pinpics.com. When we first acquired the site it had been hacked and we were working to get past that and all the issues. We were getting in to look at everything - which between how many programmers had been in the database was a little like swiss cheese. More minds are much better than one.....we want everyone's feedback.
 
Sorry you felt talked down to, as that certainly wasn't my intention. As to knowing what anybody said back in 2020 and 2021 . . . sorry. I never had a good memory and having COVID twice since last November has left me with an extremely poor memory. Glad for those who do have them, but with me, that isn't the case. Back in 2021, I know I posted during that time, too. However, who posted what . . . I really have no idea. I certainly wouldn't ever say "that's the way it is" about any issue where I am trying to work something out. Not my way.
I addressed this in an edit I made. I don't expect people to remember everything. I do expect people to gauge a person's knowledge about a situation, by reading what they are saying. And if that person is referencing prior statements made, maybe, not go with the "people just don't know how messed up things were, let me explain and how hard things are" approach.
 
I loved PinPics from the start although I lurked for a long time before I ever participated. I was proud to contribute to the community in its crowd-sourced wiki format. We kept information up to date and correct as a community.

I would guess a lot of current users have no idea that it was originally made in wiki format where everyone could make immediate additions instead of going through moderators who have no idea what's actually in their own database nor what information is correct or not. But it also contributed to the sense of community built around a site that all of us actually built. We were credited for every entry we made - these weren't PinPics' creations, nor the moderators, it was all of our work and research and content. It was our community resource and we wanted it to be the best it could be. It was a site built by the community, of the community, for the community. Not for the PinPics owners. Not for the PinPics moderators. For all pin collectors, always, in other words.

Once it was sold, it lost its accuracy and its purpose as a crowd-sourced database.

It also became monetized in multiple ways including paywalls and advertising. New owners claimed rights to material I never would have given. I have learned my lesson from this, which is also why I don't participate here as much as I would like to - I don't want more of my content taken and used in a way I did not agree to.

PinPics died the day it was sold. And nothing will ever resurrect it back to the incredible resource it was. I just wish my content had not been misused and misappropriated in the process.
Jabberwocky - We did not put up a paywall. The few ads we had on the site could not possibly come close to covering our server costs. Before the database was moved to servers in the US we were also having to pay for Heightened security so foreign entities could not hack the system. We are looking at adding back in the credit for entries.....we are going to be launching a Loyalty Program - users have been earning points since mid-November when we launched the new look of PinPics. There are many things that go in to the listing being right.....so you get points for each step - and maybe if you get 3 or more points you will be credited with adding the pin. As the Twins have noted - what was acceptable in the past is not acceptable now - we want uniformity to the listings which then helps the searching. SO when you say we monetized the content - you could not be farther from the truth. If you look at comment #439 you will see the terms in 2002 are the same as they are now. So claiming that new owners have claimed rights to material is not true. You keep saying this over and over.......it is not true. And PinPics is far from dead...........New users are joining at great numbers and old users are coming back in droves because they have heard and seen the great things we are doing. Maybe if you say things enough it will make others believe it is true......but it is not.
 
I addressed this in an edit I made. I don't expect people to remember everything. I do expect people to gauge a person's knowledge about a situation, by reading what they are saying. And if that person is referencing prior statements made, maybe, not go with the "people just don't know how messed up things were, let me explain and how hard things are" approach.

"I do expect people to gauge a person's knowledge about a situation, by reading what they are saying." - I get that and I would like to expect that from others. Obviously, it didn't work in my post from this morning. You read my comments explaining what was messed up, but what happened to what I was saying about the constructive way to help fix it and what is being done to fix it? I never approach things with a stonewall attitude - try and get it fixed or changed or figure a way around it. Sorry that I didn't impart that more clearly. Again, my offer of taking feedback still stands.
 
Jabberwocky - We did not put up a paywall.

YOU may not have, but Lenny/LANSAM did shortly after buying the site from the creators. It wasn't completely pay-walled, but things that had been free (like full-size images of the pins, and I believe the trading system) were suddenly only available to people who paid a monthly fee.

That DID happen. I'm not sure if you changed that back to free when you bought the site, or if it was changed sometime prior, but it did happen for at least a period of time after the site was originally purchased...
 
YOU may not have, but Lenny/LANSAM did shortly after buying the site from the creators. It wasn't completely pay-walled, but things that had been free (like full-size images of the pins, and I believe the trading system) were suddenly only available to people who paid a monthly fee.

That DID happen. I'm not sure if you changed that back to free when you bought the site, or if it was changed sometime prior, but it did happen for at least a period of time after the site was originally purchased...
rik1138 - History is History. We cannot go back and change what they did. It was changed back before we purchased the site......BUT Today.....the Classic Version is Free and it will ALWAYS be free. That is all we can control. We have even added to it - like being able to print out Virtual Pin Books for one. Being able to search down in your collections by collection and print those to a PDF for a virtual pin book that when you click the #under the pin thumbnail it will take you right to that pin in PinPics. If everyone wants to stay in the past that is your decision. Nothing can be changed from what Lenny did to the site...or what he tried to do. When was the last time you were in PinPics.......go take a look. I can say I am sorry for what happened after Lenny purchased the site I am sure you all felt betrayed and let down and I cannot fix that I wish I could but that cannot be changed. Come and see what we have done and what we are doing. If you want to be part of the solution we welcome you. We welcome your feedback and ideas with open arms. We will look at bringing back getting credit for pins that are added to the database correctly......We act on feedback given to us every day and in our Pin Party Zooms on Thursday nights. You are all welcome to come and I would love it if you did. History cannot be changed (though how unfair it might have been) but the future can be changed.
 
Hopemax - I would love to see your suggestions. When we bought this in 2021, we were pretty overwhelmed and may have overlooked your suggestions. If you are open to sharing them with me please do at molly@pinpics.com. When we first acquired the site it had been hacked and we were working to get past that and all the issues. We were getting in to look at everything - which between how many programmers had been in the database was a little like swiss cheese. More minds are much better than one.....we want everyone's feedback.
It's too late, the ship has sailed, as I have implied that in my previous posts. I mentioned the overwhelming nature of the task of fixing PinPics, beyond the technical backbone, and the challenges a person new to the hobby could overlook. I mentioned multiple times the need to collect Feedback from the greater pin community, especially long time users who might not have a Facebook presence, before rolling out a new version, to make sure the vision of the new owners matched the expectations of its users. Your responses, the posts on PinPics Facebook were detailing your husband's experience with failing companies and implications that you guys had a handle on the complexity and what steps needed to be taken. There was no solicitation of Feedback in the leadup (although there has been more after). People were encouraged to be patient, and we would see. Statements were made about the quality of the beta testing. And unfortunately, my experience via my husband's gives me some idea of how inadequate it was. I really tried to take you at your word, override my suspicions that you guys were in over your heads and grant you the benefit of the doubt that you knew what you were doing, and had the appropriate resources. I'm truly sorry, the site is struggling, which is why I can't seem to stop saying things when I know I need to just walk away from the discussion, but a little more humility during this process would have gone a long way. And obviously not just with me.

Now, there have been a lot of changes within the pin community, pin decisions made by Disney, non-pin decisions made by Disney to affect my personal interest levels. Plus, the deeper realization that when I joined Pinpics in 2000, I was 24 years old, and now that I'm 48, most of my pin collecting years are likely behind me. And there are just things I don't want to invest the time in at the expense of other aspects. I put my ideas out there already and they either resonated or were ignored or dismissed in favor of other POVs.

I have made some comments on pins on the website, as that is what my level of interest is these days and they were handled to varying degrees.. Duplicate pins, usually handled, although one took quite awhile and I have no idea if it was my comment or somebody else's realization that the two pins were, in fact, identical. It was a hinged pin with one listing showing it closed, and the other open. But there have been other instances where it seems like since I didn't provide a photo (which you shouldn't presume a commenter has in a form that can be uploaded), simple additional info wasn't updated or included. I submitted a comment about the location a pin was distributed, based on this info being listed on the backer card (another way someone could verify this was accurate information, by finding another photo on Worthpoint, or Ebay even if that photo couldn't be used on PinPics), in this case Tokyo's Ambassador Hotel, or pointing out the image was of a broken pin. I expected, perhaps, a note could be added in the description about the problem with the pictured pin, and a solicitation to the community for an updated photo, and / or a reference to another pin in the same series that had the missing dangle, that I mentioned existing. Secretly, I hoped that the comment would generate a review of all the pins in that series, because unfortunately of the 3? in the database I could find.. 2 are missing dangles. As that is how I would handle the hard task of updating older listings. When one pin in a series gets a hit, at least go through that group of pins to clean them up. Anyway, I didn't feel encouraged to make more comments without also taking the step of providing a photo. I'm trying to talk myself into photographing my Disney Sketchbook ornaments before I pack them away, because I keep forgetting what I own, and finding the motivation to do that lacking, and that doesn't require the steps of uploading it to someone else's system. Community sourced means meeting people where they are, accepting their level of interest, not calling them out for not doing more. People will just do less.
 
rik1138 - History is History. We cannot go back and change what they did.

Oh, it's not me that's complaining about it, I was just commenting on your response to Jabberwocky. He was complaining that someone ever used his information for profit, without his permission.
Something about the way you wrote "Jabberwocky - We did not put up a paywall." made it sound like you were telling him that it never happened...
I was just stating that it DID happen at some point, and that's why he's upset about it...
I know all this crap about previous owners and what they did is frustrating as hell, but may just a different wording would help... Like:
"Jabberwocky- the paywall issue was with the previous owners, and we have no intention of ever putting the database behind a paywall in the future."
Or something...

I think most people will come around to the idea that the site is going in the right direction again, but the paywall thing did happen once, and that can make people immediately put their guard up when anything changes...

When was the last time you were in PinPics.......go take a look.

Just poked around a little bit, and immediately had one question- how do I change my password? I can't seem to find that setting anywhere... But maybe I'm just overlooking it...
Account Settings, and then Edit Profile seemed the obvious choice, but no password options there...
 
It's too late, the ship has sailed, as I have implied that in my previous posts. I mentioned the overwhelming nature of the task of fixing PinPics, beyond the technical backbone, and the challenges a person new to the hobby could overlook. I mentioned multiple times the need to collect Feedback from the greater pin community, especially long time users who might not have a Facebook presence, before rolling out a new version, to make sure the vision of the new owners matched the expectations of its users. Your responses, the posts on PinPics Facebook were detailing your husband's experience with failing companies and implications that you guys had a handle on the complexity and what steps needed to be taken. There was no solicitation of Feedback in the leadup (although there has been more after). People were encouraged to be patient, and we would see. Statements were made about the quality of the beta testing. And unfortunately, my experience via my husband's gives me some idea of how inadequate it was. I really tried to take you at your word, override my suspicions that you guys were in over your heads and grant you the benefit of the doubt that you knew what you were doing, and had the appropriate resources. I'm truly sorry, the site is struggling, which is why I can't seem to stop saying things when I know I need to just walk away from the discussion, but a little more humility during this process would have gone a long way. And obviously not just with me.

Now, there have been a lot of changes within the pin community, pin decisions made by Disney, non-pin decisions made by Disney to affect my personal interest levels. Plus, the deeper realization that when I joined Pinpics in 2000, I was 24 years old, and now that I'm 48, most of my pin collecting years are likely behind me. And there are just things I don't want to invest the time in at the expense of other aspects. I put my ideas out there already and they either resonated or were ignored or dismissed in favor of other POVs.

I have made some comments on pins on the website, as that is what my level of interest is these days and they were handled to varying degrees.. Duplicate pins, usually handled, although one took quite awhile and I have no idea if it was my comment or somebody else's realization that the two pins were, in fact, identical. It was a hinged pin with one listing showing it closed, and the other open. But there have been other instances where it seems like since I didn't provide a photo (which you shouldn't presume a commenter has in a form that can be uploaded), simple additional info wasn't updated or included. I submitted a comment about the location a pin was distributed, based on this info being listed on the backer card (another way someone could verify this was accurate information, by finding another photo on Worthpoint, or Ebay even if that photo couldn't be used on PinPics), in this case Tokyo's Ambassador Hotel, or pointing out the image was of a broken pin. I expected, perhaps, a note could be added in the description about the problem with the pictured pin, and a solicitation to the community for an updated photo, and / or a reference to another pin in the same series that had the missing dangle, that I mentioned existing. Secretly, I hoped that the comment would generate a review of all the pins in that series, because unfortunately of the 3? in the database I could find.. 2 are missing dangles. As that is how I would handle the hard task of updating older listings. When one pin in a series gets a hit, at least go through that group of pins to clean them up. Anyway, I didn't feel encouraged to make more comments without also taking the step of providing a photo. I'm trying to talk myself into photographing my Disney Sketchbook ornaments before I pack them away, because I keep forgetting what I own, and finding the motivation to do that lacking, and that doesn't require the steps of uploading it to someone else's system. Community sourced means meeting people where they are, accepting their level of interest, not calling them out for not doing more. People will just do less.
Hope we did ask for feedback when we purchased the site. If you decide not to use PinPics...then do not use it. One of the main pieces of feedback we received from DPF was that everyone wanted the Reference Center back that was on DizPins. We have created a Feedback portion in your personal profile - one where you have a Feedback rating, the numbers of trades and personal feedback left on your profile by those trading with you. This was by far and away the most requested feature. I do not think some of you understand the brevity of PinPics. How many pins there are, how information was entered incorrectly for YEARS. We finally in September of 2021 put in place a standard to entering a pin and made certain fields mandatory - like the year it was published, the park it was released at etc. There are over 136k pins in PinPics......if we had gone in and corrected every pin it would have been ions before we could have launched the new site and format......and the app. We work on PinPics everyday all day. We thank those that go in and leave us comments which I personally look at every day. Maybe not on the weekends because that is when we are busy doing what we need to do to raise the capital to enhance this website and FREE service. We do that Hope - when we get a comment on one pin if we can tell it is in a series - we go in and fix the entire series. We are in the process of photographing and cataloging Holland Hayes CL and HM collection - so there is not a question if one is a scrapper. Every time we do this we find a set that is not tied together or is wrong and we take the steps to tie them together. We have his entire collection of Starter Lanyards from the beginning of pin trading - the ones that have been scrapped and faked so horribly - and each one of these sets or series have to be fixed and we fix them.....Holland is a huge supporter of ours....and if you do not know him he was Scoop Sanderson at WDW for 20+ years and the face of pin trading. We are also cataloging his collection from DL along with some other completists. We are committed to this site and making it better whether any of you want to believe it or not. We do all of those things to verify pins - I have used Worthpoint since it's inception in 2007. We could not solicit feedback as we were acquiring PinPics....but we did plenty after. And quite frankly we were attacked here on DPF. A lot of you now had someone to yell at and point the finger at, pick apart and tear down. All that pent up angst came at us like a Tidal Wave - but we were and are committed. I cannot tell you the amount of people that have thanked us, come back to PinPics, gotten back involved in the community etc. Hope I am 58 years old.....but totally young at heart. I am not calling anyone out for doing more or less. We totally meet people where they are........and we have. You are right it was and is a HUGE task.....and we are committed to it - that does not mean anyone who reads this has to be.....just we are. Please do not try to assume or guess our motives.....I have always been a huge collector or antiques and other collectibles. 6 years ago there was a site that I loved and that is part of the vision we have for PinPics. And so much of it has come to pass and is coming to pass with the app. We cannot read minds......and anyone can reach out to me at molly@pinpics.com. If you are done and the ship has sailed....then I thank you for using PinPics and hope you come back some day.
 
I believe I am possibly one of the DPF members who felt attacked and stopped interacting with your posts (for auctions or anything at all.) I feel that interacting with a member who attacked me personally, out of left field and then basically shut me down when I tried to reach out to explain privately, is a very good reason to walk away from that person. I am surprised you are surprised that this is what happens. My conclusion after our last interaction, was you didn't want my involvement in your auctions or posts. My logic (and its not personal towards you) if someone hates you (ie, your statements made me feel you hated me, they were pretty darn harsh), why bother posting a bid in an auction. In this situation, I really would never expect to win the auction. Would anyone? Again, I am sorry you misunderstood my Pinpics post from some year's ago. Perhaps you might find a way to finally forgive me? And I happily have already done the same (forgave you.) And perhaps we can move forward. (But please don't attack me again.)

Note... IMO the above situation is why this forum is dying.

I have not weighed in on this discussion/debate because of the past attacks on me personally (see above) due to the hot topic of the business entity Pinpics. These past attacks (which basically are 'shut up to you' and 'your opinion is not valid') are one reason I don't post a lot more on DPF, but note, I have not gone away. And note, I do not want additional posts or personal attacks sent my way, because of this post. (Note: Posting how my post makes you feel is fine, because all DPF member's feelings are valid, but no personal attacks please.) I support @hopemax @Randakinskywalker @rik1138 @Jabberwocky for focusing on their issues with pinpics. They have a right to decide themselves when they are 'over it' (as it is not my place to tell them how to feel.) I am also very happy for those that support and love Pinpics. Kudos to you for finding your way and loving Pinpics. The difference of opinion expressed in this thread is no reason for anyone to be less than supportive of all parties or stop participating in DPF (the way I feel about those comments... emotional blackmail... because there is so much I love about DPF and that includes its members.) The problem with this thread (I feel) is NOT the criticism, questions, info sharing and feedback of the business entity we know as pinpics, but something else that I wish would stop. Let's continue to support each other in a healthy fashion and continue the Pinpics discussion.

Once this discussion resolves I am all for moving on back to pin trading... via PinandPop because Pinpics trading is exactly as stated above... lopsided offers and no responses to reasonable offers. I make so many amazing trades on pinandpop! Its been wonderful to have such a robust online trading platform again! Gush, Gush, Gush! Perhaps a suggestion... Pinpics could hold a virtual class on ways their members can identify equitable trade offers that have a chance of being accepted by the other party. But for me... I am 'over it' mostly because I have a way to trade online again... pinandpop! These platforms are competing for our time and attention... my opinion, let them compete. Pulling at my heart strings and peer pressuring me to join virtual discussions, etc. is, I FEEL, a waste of my time, so that will not be happening for me. Of course, others are absolutely welcome to FEEL differently. I totally respect that. :) For me its: SHOW ME THE TRADING!

Healthy debate is just that... Healthy.
Who knows what's going to happen. It's really sad that pinpics went downhill before the pandemic even occurred. I was in love back in the day with the site. The people who purchased it ran it into the ground. They threatened to sue the other website that was actually better than them.

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MickeyMouseRules - I met you at Pinchella with my sister 2.5 years ago. We had a good interaction after some through this forum were not right after we purchased PinPics. I am not sure what auctions you are referring to as I never had any auctions with you. I met you at Pinchella and as far as I knew we were fine....so I am not sure what you are referring to as I decided until we launched the new PinPics not to be involved here because of the animosity from most members. It has been wonderful to see many come back to PinPics and I have met several of you at pin events. I never attacked your personally Mickey Mouse Rules.....I have no idea what you are talking about. I did not know I needed to forgive you for anything.....again at Pinchella in September of 2021 we met and I sat down and talked to you with my sister. No one has ever said Shut Up or your opinion does not matter......We acquired PP to support the pin community......Maybe I am not who you are talking to about attacking and definitely hope not. I love the idea on having a virtual class on Pin Trading. I am happy that I saw that you received and gave positive feedback on a couple of trades you made on PP. I am not peer pressuring anyone to join a discussion - I am just making it available. Even if you just want to listen. I cannot win for losing here.......I guess I am trying to make something better for all of you that I cannot make better.......so all I can say is seriously I wish the best to all of you. If you decide to come back to PP we welcome you and your feedback with open arms.
 
MickeyMouseRules - I met you at Pinchella with my sister 2.5 years ago. We had a good interaction after some through this forum were not right after we purchased PinPics. I am not sure what auctions you are referring to as I never had any auctions with you. I met you at Pinchella and as far as I knew we were fine....so I am not sure what you are referring to as I decided until we launched the new PinPics not to be involved here because of the animosity from most members. It has been wonderful to see many come back to PinPics and I have met several of you at pin events. I never attacked your personally Mickey Mouse Rules.....I have no idea what you are talking about. I did not know I needed to forgive you for anything.....again at Pinchella in September of 2021 we met and I sat down and talked to you with my sister. No one has ever said Shut Up or your opinion does not matter......We acquired PP to support the pin community......Maybe I am not who you are talking to about attacking and definitely hope not. I love the idea on having a virtual class on Pin Trading. I am happy that I saw that you received and gave positive feedback on a couple of trades you made on PP. I am not peer pressuring anyone to join a discussion - I am just making it available. Even if you just want to listen. I cannot win for losing here.......I guess I am trying to make something better for all of you that I cannot make better.......so all I can say is seriously I wish the best to all of you. If you decide to come back to PP we welcome you and your feedback with open arms.

Molly, the comment was not made to you. She was replying to another DPF member’s post


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@MollyAnne that statement was not directed at you... As stated I will use the best platform for me. I am indifferent to pinpics to be honest. But I use it a very small amount right now.

The comment is directed at the quoted post in my thread and the post they deleted. I have no issues with you at all... And I truly have no interest in anything but trading on pinpics. I work too much to support my family to waste time listening to a virtual meeting or posting on another forum, etc. Trading is my goal!
Thank you MickeyMouse Rules.....I wasn't sure! Happy Trading
 
I post this photo, knowing it will mean nothing, and will probably make me look more like a freak, that can and should be dunked on. The binders contain the monthly release calendars from US Parks, Paris, Soda Fountain. The back binder is the images I collected from the Chinese websites and went through and identified every pin by their PinPics number and passed a lot of this information on to Bev when she was one of the Admin / Mods of Pinpics so that those "Be aware that this pin is being offered for sale directly to pin collectors from a factory in China" messages could be added to listings that didn't already have it. And my Scoop Sanderson pin, so yeah, I know who he is. If he still has his notebook where he wrote the names of the pins he awarded it's #590. Edited date, I thought I got it on one trip but no, I got it on a different one. January 2003 is correct, or at least I did take a trip that month.

What is not visible are all the listings saved from previous versions of DSFs online database of pins, and US park releases on the old ODPT.com Disney site, event catalogs and other information in digital form pulled from the Internet Archive searches of Disney's websites, that I didn't print out because it's less conducive to printing. As close to original source material as I could find, in the event that one day we woke up and PinPics was gone, and knowing how sue-happy the pin community seems to be, so it couldn't come from PinPics itself, except what would fall under reasonable Fair Use, and the hope that there were other individuals who had done the same in their area of expertise (I am short on Asian information, and regret not saving the Disney Auctions information), so it could be rebuilt. In defending your bona fides, what you have done is diminish the magnitude of work others have done to capture what they could with the resources they had.

No, I never had access to what Holland had access to. I do I was a 20-something, random person who lived in Washington State without regular access to parks. I live in Colorado now, still far away. Molly Anne mentioned that I didn't come to an in-person, or attend Zoom, well, Pinpics people don't know me either and now they know why in-person is unlikely, and why to most people in pin world I am a nobody, except here. I have been committed to the idea that one day, literally every pin would have to be recreated somewhere, even if it was my own personal one. I have sketches of website wire frames, I have developed taxonomies (yes, like the Natural World) to break down and organize all the information that would need to added. Far, far more than the number of fields that Britt included in the original website, and every dang pin website, including the newest PinPics and the new My Pin Central, keeps limiting itself to. I have written all kinds of Pin trading background information based on the types of questions new collectors ask, that I've yet to see any of the new websites put out there, that I'm purposefully, not defining in greater detail. I have the receipts of most every pin I purchased direct from a variety of retailers, and most of the backers. Certainly, everything since about 2014 has never been removed from the cards because I understood how important it was to keep those pins with their original cards, in a world of counterfeits and scrappers, hoping for the day where I would have a place to begin the photography section. And somewhere in the web, is my attempt to build a database by hand, until I was thwarted by my lack of backend, database administrator knowledge in a Windows machine environment to reliably restore the site, with data intact, if there were any issues. Not building the UI interface, the backend operational stuff that you rely on your programmer for. Don't have the resources to hire that bit out, and I really, really tried to learn how to do it. But this is the stuff people learn in a professional environment, and my DH kept trying to remind me of how far I got without having professional skills and resources to lean on, when I would hit brick walls, until I got to the one I couldn't get through.

If you have any help at all, congratulations, that's more than I had and was still trying to accomplish. I cringe knowing, how many hours upon hours, I devoted to this and have very little digital to show for it (which is another reason why I am placing limits on what I'll do for others. I burnt myself out trying to do it solo.) I do agree with you that most people do not understand what is required, but do not assume that everyone that is participating in this discussion is one of those people. I make my statements, knowing how much time I spent on this over the last 10 years, and how much work would have been required if I could overcome that last hurdle. But I repeat, I was willing to recreate every single pin by myself (although I was hoping pin friends would be motivated, through my dedication) to help out, and took steps to do so. Now, I think I've ran out of time.

 
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Unfortunately you don't know the truth. There's some info they're not giving out. Who are the true owners of pinpics? What if the person who says this is hiding in plain sight and not telling you the truth?

Can you really trust people? Who knows if they're lying?

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Hopemax - I would love to see your suggestions. When we bought this in 2021, we were pretty overwhelmed and may have overlooked your suggestions. If you are open to sharing them with me please do at molly@pinpics.com. When we first acquired the site it had been hacked and we were working to get past that and all the issues. We were getting in to look at everything - which between how many programmers had been in the database was a little like swiss cheese. More minds are much better than one.....we want everyone's feedback.
Feedback is feedback no matter how it is shared. Please realize no one here is against the development of the pin trading community. I can open up a OneNote and get tons of feedback for any pin database just from looking at the numerous Pinpics/PTDB/Pin&Pop/Disney Pinventory/MyPinCentral forums instead of defending a product no one is attacking the advancement of. We are all here to help you, because it helps us.

I worked in customer service for 8 years and never once have I told a customer to email us with suggestions instead of noting their feedback on the spot. I think that's what turns me off from Pinpics now. I don't feel like open and honest feedback can be provided without some sort of slight being felt or barrier to communication being brought up. The customers here have spoken over and over again. And at this point, it's kinda moot for us to keep communicating to a wall.

Criticism hurts, but that's the nature of business. Buying the business, you've now opened yourself up to feedback of others (good or bad) and the frustrations with the former owners. There's a positive in each message here on how to proceed forward. It's what you do with that info that's up to you.

If you'd like some unsolicited advice on how to start winning people back, maybe start by summarizing what feedback you've gained by being on this forum. That's how I started winning my customers back who were disgruntled with me.

Here's my favorite Walt quote that I live by:
"You can dream, create, design, and build the most wonderful place in the world...but it requires people to make the dream a reality."
 
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Unfortunately you don't know the truth. There's some info they're not giving out. Who are the true owners of pinpics? What if the person who says this is hiding in plain sight and not telling you the truth?

Can you really trust people? Who knows if they're lying?

Sent from my motorola edge (2022) using Tapatalk
The rumors were discussed when the sale happened, but without anyone willing to pony up proof like Diana (Tiggernut) attempted during the LANSAM debacle, they remain rumors. This is another way that I have tried to give the benefit of the doubt to Molly Anne and her family and focusing on the quality of the product from my POV as a user vs the brand promotion in the lead up . For what little good that did me.

And that’s another part of what has happened here. The people who have presented themselves here as representatives of a *brand* with a business-like approach are treated like people do with other brands in the real world. When people are chit chatty about pins as their *hobby*. It’s a far different vibe as part of a different sets of expectations that come along with different roles. We are her customers or potential customers, and not just in a more casual pin sales way like in the Marketplace section, and that is an unusual relationship between DPF members.
 
Feedback is feedback no matter how it is shared. Please realize no one here is against the development of the pin trading community. I can open up a OneNote and get tons of feedback for any pin database just from looking at the numerous Pinpics/PTDB/Pin&Pop/Disney Pinventory/MyPinCentral forums instead of defending a product no one is attacking the advancement of. We are all here to help you, because it helps us.

I worked in customer service for 8 years and never once have I told a customer to email us with suggestions instead of noting their feedback on the spot. I think that's what turns me off from Pinpics now. I don't feel like open and honest feedback can be provided without some sort of slight being felt or barrier to communication being brought up. The customers here have spoken over and over again. And at this point, it's kinda moot for us to keep communicating to a wall.

Criticism hurts, but that's the nature of business. Buying the business, you've now opened yourself up to feedback of others (good or bad) and the frustrations with the former owners. There's a positive in each message here on how to proceed forward. It's what you do with that info that's up to you.

If you'd like some unsolicited advice on how to start winning people back, maybe start by summarizing what feedback you've gained by being on this forum. That's how I started winning my customers back who were disgruntled with me.

Here's my favorite Walt quote that I live by:
"You can dream, create, design, and build the most wonderful place in the world...but it requires people to make the dream a reality."

So 2.5 years ago after we acquired PinPics we asked for feedback and put a lot of that into use…especially that everyone wanted the Reference center.
We were trying to listen and get feedback between all of the negativity being slung at us. So I have not been back on the forum since. There wasn’t anything constructive coming out of it all. There are Disney pin people in a lot of different places that were glad we purchased PinPics and gave us negative and positive feedback.
The past is the past….we are looking towards the future.


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Unfortunately you don't know the truth. There's some info they're not giving out. Who are the true owners of pinpics? What if the person who says this is hiding in plain sight and not telling you the truth?

Can you really trust people? Who knows if they're lying?

Sent from my motorola edge (2022) using Tapatalk

Ok I am sorry this is absurd. My husband, my sister and me own PinPics. We purchased the assets of PinPics. No one else in involved in the ownership of PinPics. Period. Conspiracy theories in regards to this are a waste of your time and ours.


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So 2.5 years ago after we acquired PinPics we asked for feedback and put a lot of that into use…especially that everyone wanted the Reference center.
We were trying to listen and get feedback between all of the negativity being slung at us. So I have not been back on the forum since. There wasn’t anything constructive coming out of it all. There are Disney pin people in a lot of different places that were glad we purchased PinPics and gave us negative and positive feedback.
The past is the past….we are looking towards the future.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Also we got a lot of feedback from this forum from The Twins.
The information on the pins coming in from China is still on so many pins and very helpful to people using the site. We are just so glad to have Holland as a resource, friend and ultimate pin friend and supporter. We want the information in PinPics to be accurate for everyone at every stage of collecting. And most of all we want people to have fun and enjoy the hobby!!


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Oh, it's not me that's complaining about it, I was just commenting on your response to Jabberwocky. He was complaining that someone ever used his information for profit, without his permission.
Something about the way you wrote "Jabberwocky - We did not put up a paywall." made it sound like you were telling him that it never happened...
I was just stating that it DID happen at some point, and that's why he's upset about it...
I know all this crap about previous owners and what they did is frustrating as hell, but may just a different wording would help... Like:
"Jabberwocky- the paywall issue was with the previous owners, and we have no intention of ever putting the database behind a paywall in the future."
Or something...

I think most people will come around to the idea that the site is going in the right direction again, but the paywall thing did happen once, and that can make people immediately put their guard up when anything changes...



Just poked around a little bit, and immediately had one question- how do I change my password? I can't seem to find that setting anywhere... But maybe I'm just overlooking it...
Account Settings, and then Edit Profile seemed the obvious choice, but no password options there...
So go to PinPics | Free Disney Pin Trading Database and choose Login in the Header. You will see in red type the Reset PW info.
 
I don't want to be involved in the Pinpics conversation whatsoever, but I will say that I'm disappointed that ever since Pinpics was originally sold almost a decade ago, it feels like Pinpics-related threads always end up in a huge fight and our DPF community losing valuable members on both sides of the argument. It's becoming very taboo to talk about Pinpics on this forum, much like you don't talk about religion, politics, or money at the family dinner table.

My humble opinion is that there will never be a resolution to this problem, and both sides have historically been unreasonable in their own ways. MODS, do as you must, but history shows that these threads will always end up being chaotic and messy. What is the value of threads like this? Maybe we should make a subforums with Database Updates where MODS from Pintrading Database and Pinpics and Pin&Pop can share out new features and website changes, but it would merely be informative and not allow for public discourse or responses. There is a time and place for everything, but I think continually allowing for the Pinpics debate to bleed into this forum will ultimately lead to this community continuing to die off. Seeing a dear member like @pretty_Omi being swayed away from this website makes me very sad as a someone who has been here from the very start.

I think my main takeaway to my fellow DPF'ers is as such: Don't like Pinpics or the new owners? Don't use it, don't support it. I have moved away from trading on Pinpics because I can't get on board with the new updates and I rarely get any responses from my trade requests anyways. Doesn't mean that I want to ruin the fun for any other users who support it and find value in it. I understand that there are people here who feel like they have more of a vested interest in it because they uploaded their own photos or contributed what they consider their own "intellectual property"... if you are that worked up about it, start a class action lawsuit over it... but to continuously vent about it on the forum definitely feels like banging your head against the wall over and over and over again... Pin trading is still very much in it's infancy, and although we want things to stay the same forever and change is sometimes scary, there is a plethora of new websites that you can use and support to get your pin trading fix or to utilize their database. While I no longer use Pinpics for trading (I still use the database), I have been immersed in Pin&Pop lately and am really enjoying it. In 5 years that may completely change and I may start to utilize a new trading website... the fact of the matter is that you have to move forward and try not to dwell too much on "what used to be" or you will end up stuck in the past. We have no control over what the Pinpics owners have done to the website over the last decade, and anyone who feels like they deserved any sort of input or control should have filed a class action lawsuit by now. Otherwise what's the point of screaming at a computer screen about things you have no control over?

Our little DPF community is slowly dying and our long-term members are quickly disappearing and threads like this DO NOT help our longevity. This is by no means trying to "shut anyone up" on either side of the argument. But alas, this argument has been happening for 10 years now and it always ends up like this. It's getting tired and stale to outsiders who do not want to engage with this kind of drama on a forum that is supposed to represent the Disney Magic of pin trading.

*END OF RANT*
 
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