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Q&A sessions with LANSAM and PinPics

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Q&A sessions with LANSAM and PinPics
There are 2 sides to this:

1. Your garden variety scrapper sellers, and the ones I am referring to are located from north of east coast to south of east coast, those post the actual pictures of the pins. They actually post their own photos and they sell scrappers.

They probably do this for 2 reasons:

a. They do not want to get into trouble with Ebay for copyright violations
b. Showing the picture of the actual pin helps them to look "honest" and gives the newbie buyers a false sense of security

2. The scrapper sellers who pump out low LE pins, on the other hand, are really the ones who should provide actual pictures.

See this recent discussion about yet another Jes pin http://disneypinforum.com/showthread.php?11989-Jessica-as-the-Evil-Queen

If the seller puts the pic in post #14, which is the actual pic, he can't sell this pin. Instead, he uses stock photo from Pinpics which is actually the concept art from disneystore.com or odpt.com.

So, Lansam's intentions maybe good in this, but there are already scrapper sellers out there (for rack & hm pins) who use their own pics anyway.

I know Ebay's protection is good now, but it has only improved in the last 2-3 yrs or so. I have received a defective version of . In the 2 years I have been collecting, I have seen this particular pin on Ebay only twice. The one that came to my home had a small hole in the enamel. The seller refunded me shipping both ways as well as the pin. But thinking that I found a rare pin finally and then getting a dud was hard on me :lol:

So, in conclusion, at least for me since I am shifting my collection from rack pins to LE 1000 and lower, actual pics are better.
 
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Merryweather said:
Okie dokie then. Do you have any other questions that you think were avoided?

I do not refer to yesterday's chat though. I was in the CR from start until the end, I personally found it chaotic.

Lansam (all 3 members were there and I think Samantha was typing) made an effort to give each user a turn to ask at least one question. I think their intention was to have a second round of questions. Sadly, we were plagued by technical difficulties as well as people typing stuff simultenously. It was very difficult to follow, for me anyway. Then we ran out of time and people who know each other got cutesy.
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One of my questions didn't get answered and I asked it twice. It was when it was my turn to ask a question again.

Sorry we got "cutesy" at the end. Figgy, Dom and I have known each other for years. I'm sure we didn't make you feel left out.
 
Bellecat22 said:
Sorry we got "cutesy" at the end. Figgy, Dom and I have known each other for years. I'm sure we didn't make you feel left out.
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No worries, you did not bother me at all :) I just wrote it there to explain how 2 hrs went by. And first 20 mins or so were gone trying the first chat room, then passing to the other chat room etc.
 
Let me make one point clear, I am for sellers using original pictures, however, I am completely against Lansam changing a 12+ year old policy restricting access to pictures that everyone has contributed knowing they were allowed to be used freely on eBay. Not using pinpics photos solves nothing, dishonest people will find another way to be dishonest. eBay already has the best possible protection for buyers, it is 100% times safer due to these protections vs buying a pin off eBay vs making a trade either in person or via mail or buying pins off this very board.

As far as Im concerned, when the picture is loaded onto pinpics, the pictures owner agreed to let everyone use it on eBay as long as they gave credit to pinpics. I don't see how PinPics can try and revoke permission that was given by the original owner. The other result is that fewer new people will learn on PinPics and without seeing PinPics being advertised in a way, won't know where to go for information about pins and may be unaware of the existence of fake pins making eBay a more dangerous, less educated place.


The only benefit I heard so far is that people might avoid certain pins if an original picture is shown, however, even if its not pictured and they get a bad pin, they are still completely covered. Except for saving them a little time, I don't see how it makes it any safer or am I missing something?
 
latemetal said:
As far as Im concerned, when the picture is loaded onto pinpics, the pictures owner agreed to let everyone use it on eBay as long as they gave credit to pinpics. I don't see how PinPics can try and revoke permission that was given by the original owner.
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But it sounds like, from what was posted earlier, pinpics really CAN'T keep anyone from using pinpics pictures in an ebay sale because pinpics doesn't own the copyrights to those pictures, watermark or no. The most they can do is contact ebay and inform them about the use of a "stock" photo without original owner (not pinpics) permission which is against ebay's policy. http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/image-text.html

This just sounds like a nightmare to enforce.

Actually I really don't care about ebay. Like it's been mentioned before, if someone buys an ebay pin with a stock photo and aren't happy, ebay has buyer protections in place. I'm more concerned about the DPF sales board. The question of "Can we use them on the DPF sales board" never seemed to get answered. But even then, it seems like pinpics still couldn't prevent that legally. DPF would have to change their terms of use, which of course they could.

Am I right in my thinking here?
 
mom24k9s said:
The question of "Can we use them on the DPF sales board" never seemed to get answered.
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It got answered I believe, by Figgy. She said that the idea behind this was to prevent scrapper sales. As we know each other more intimately the forums, and believing that no one on the boards would knowingly sell scrappers, it should be ok to use Pinpics pictures on the boards. She said this somewhere towards the end if I remember right. I am not going to check the chat logs again though, I much rather get a root canal instead of going through chat logs :lol:
 
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Selen, I noticed in one of your post above you linked to PinPics with your picture. The way I see it, this ban is just the beginning. I'm concerned that soon you won't be able to use PinPics links or pics on any forum other than theirs. The way they answered the questions that I could understand (whole thing was painful to try to read) it seems like this is the beginning. Be careful what you wish for, you may get more than you bargained for. They very carefully stepped around the issues and I was disappointed to say the least. They answered none of my questions that I sent in to them. I think they are trying to control too much and it's going to come around and bite them. I hope I'm wrong, but I've been in business long enough to read between the lines. If they restrict eBay what's to stop them from restricting DPF or any other forum? If we have to use our own photos, how can we have a grail list? It's hard to photograph pins you don't have yet. They never addressed that.
 
swim2sea said:
[The way I see it, this ban is just the beginning. I'm concerned that soon you won't be able to use PinPics links or pics on any forum other than theirs.
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While this is a valid concern, I believe their intention was to control the sale of scarppers and not what people on the forums do. I would like to think that LANSAM is open to polite, non-accusing communication.

Maybe I am naive, but I hope that a simple :"Are you really sure that this is a good idea? I ask you please to reconsider this." will work instead of ganging up on them right off the bat. What some see as controlling, I perceive as "not well thought out". I would like to believe that with time, and with positive critiques from the community, they will fix issues.

I still hope for the best, but there is nothing wrong with being prepared for the worst.
 
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I agree. I'm hoping that things will be good or even better. We are lucky to have PinPics and I for one would not be so into the hobby were it not for them. The site enabled me to see the possibilties for pins (although my hubby sees it a bit differently). I hope that you are correct and that they haven't really thought things through. But I'm being prepared for the worst and taking precautions. Like putting all my owns and wants into Excel and keeping it updated.
 
Will this mean we can't copy our wants to a spread sheet to take to the pin event. We like to make up a sheet with our most wanted so we can keep up when the trading wirlwind starts.
 
bretu said:
Will this mean we can't copy our wants to a spread sheet to take to the pin event. We like to make up a sheet with our most wanted so we can keep up when the trading wirlwind starts.
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Why do you believe this will happen?

And maybe it would be less confusing if all of the stuff about the picture usage was kept in the thread titled as such so we don't keep bumping both?
 
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bretu said:
Will this mean we can't copy our wants to a spread sheet to take to the pin event. We like to make up a sheet with our most wanted so we can keep up when the trading wirlwind starts.
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While I can not answer you 110% on this one (yeah, i want things 110%) , I don't see why not. Pin event is for trading. The only entity with Commercial Interest there would be Disney. Individual people go to the events (unless they are selling stuff) to have fun and to trade pins. If that is not in keeping with Pinpics original mission, then I would not know what is.

They allow their pictures to be used for "NON-COMMERCIAL" purposes. The definition of non-commercial can be argued of course, but I think just for trading copying should still be ok regardless if you use any of the forum, if you attend events and what not.

I think to avoid paper waste, Pinpics should develop their own app. Now, that would be fab :)
 
Merryweather said:
While I can not answer you 110% on this one (yeah, i want things 110%) , I don't see why not. Pin event is for trading. The only entity with Commercial Interest there would be Disney. Individual people go to the events (unless they are selling stuff) to have fun and to trade pins. If that is not in keeping with Pinpics original mission, then I would not know what is.

They allow their pictures to be used for "NON-COMMERCIAL" purposes. The definition of non-commercial can be argued of course, but I think just for trading copying should still be ok regardless if you use any of the forum, if you attend events and what not.

I think to avoid paper waste, Pinpics should develop their own app. Now, that would be fab :)
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IIRC, someone (markheardjr ?) developed an iphone app for personal trading/wants/needs purposes -- disney wouldnt allow it to be posted on the app store :(

I had the same idea at one point until I realized that the same would probably happen, and my suspicions were confirmed by what happened to mark's app. :/
 
Cicada said:
IIRC, someone (markheardjr ?) developed an iphone app for personal trading/wants/needs purposes -- disney wouldnt allow it to be posted on the app store :(
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images



DANG IT!
 
Cicada said:
IIRC, someone (markheardjr ?) developed an iphone app for personal trading/wants/needs purposes -- disney wouldnt allow it to be posted on the app store :(

I had the same idea at one point until I realized that the same would probably happen, and my suspicions were confirmed by what happened to mark's app. :/
Click to expand...

Yep, he did. The problem Disney had was not with the app, but the fact that there was a fee for the app (I think $.99)
 
broncobilly83 said:
Yep, he did. The problem Disney had was not with the app, but the fact that there was a fee for the app (I think $.99)
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ah; they want their cut, eh? :p

it's tough as an indie developer to put your hard work out there for free.

what was really cool about his app too is that it was all native, meaning it doesnt require an internet connection/cell connection, so you'd be able to use it on non-active iphones or the ipod touch.
 
Is there a way to develop a general collectors app, that has a fee. But then have an add-on that is free that contains the HM pins?
 
FYI, new message on Pin Talk that they are pulling the Q&A thread, PM answers, Chat Log, and Lenny responds threads. At this exact moment, they are still there so if anyone wants a copy they better save it to their computer, pronto. Hopefully, no one was on vacation and wanted to read them when they got home.
 
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And there gone....

4 days to submit questions, 2 days to look at the answers.... Pretty quick to hide everything that happened. Guess they finally realized how it made them look. Its one thing to lock them and keep them around for reference, its another to pull them completely.
 
Me too I already feel marginalised. Thnking about this last night in bed!! it for me is one of the indications of the fact that anthony an samantha have only been in this a year or so (no disrespect) at the moment fr me what theya re doing is very usacentric. They posted a forum of different areas for people (interestingly removed today) and missed the uk disney store but included the us one. Now we all know how much chat there is about the former apparently they dont! If people dont speak english they usually google translate thats what I do when dealing wth things this way although I speak bad french so can write it,
Have to say it again I am feeling sriously unloved and instead of wanted to help with pintalk it is pushing me away,#

Jacqui
 
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